It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
tinyE: Are we seriously in here bitching about the legitimacy of The Red Cross now?

I give up on this planet! I'm moving to Jupiter!
Don't forget to change your account location ;).Cheers
I hate this bul**hit.
Why should the red cross be suddenly removed from all media?
Isn't seeing the symbol on medipacks in every game the perfect way to make people remember what it means?

It annoys me a lot that they also force modifications in old games (see Duke Nukem & others).
I need mods that restore everything as it was >:(
Post edited January 17, 2017 by phaolo
avatar
phaolo: Isn't seeing the symbol on medipacks in every game the perfect way to make people remember what it means?
Thing is, it's NOT really what it means. And that confusion may be what forces them to speak up when they walk across this kind of representation.

That cross does not means "here are medecines". It means "we're the Red Cross, and we're protected by the Geneva Convention. Don't shoot!". And they want that meaning to stick in everyone's mind if they don't want to end up with a rocket up the backside or a bomb on the noggin', like what happened to "Medecins Sans Frontières" last year...
Post edited January 17, 2017 by Kardwill
avatar
phaolo: Isn't seeing the symbol on medipacks in every game the perfect way to make people remember what it means?
avatar
Kardwill: Thing is, it's NOT really what it means. And that confusion may be what forces them to speak up when they walk across this kind of representation.
That cross does not means "here are medecines". It means "we're the Red Cross, and we're protected by the Geneva Convention. Don't shoot!".
Well, that symbol makes people think of safety, health, medicines, medics, cures.
Is this that really wrong?

And for soldiers.. I doubt that they're trained to follow videogame logic anyway.
Post edited January 17, 2017 by phaolo
avatar
phaolo: Well, that symbol makes people think of safety, health, medicines, medics, cures.
Is this that really wrong?
They are positive meanings, but they are still targeted in warzones. So it's understandable the red cross wants to preserve its "special snowflake" meaning, to limit the risk of the "woops, we destroyed an hospital? Well, it's war, shit happens" "accidents" we saw in 2015-2016.
The symbol itself will not magically stop bombs, but its protected status will make officers very nervous when they plan an artillery strike in the vicinity. And you don't want an undertrained militiaman mistaking it for an "enemy power up" symbol. :/
Post edited January 17, 2017 by Kardwill
avatar
Wishbone: I guess they're pretty fucking selective about when they choose to enforce this, huh? There have always been red crosses in tons of games. Taito's Operation Wolf (1987) springs to mind.
Alien Breed3D on Amiga (aaaah, memories :D) had them too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJjQopEx2D0

52:04.
avatar
MaxFulvus: A red cross appears on almost all items used to health people. It's an universal symbol. So what, Red Cross will ban all these signs on everything ? It's just a question of copyright, nothing to see with the Geneva Convention...
Except...

"Those responsible may be unaware that use of the red cross emblem is restricted under the Geneva Conventions for the Protection of War Victims of 12 August 1949, and that unauthorised use of this sign in the United Kingdom is an offence under the Geneva Conventions Act 1957."

Perhaps it's only in blighty that it's breaking GC acts, but that'd be weird, saying anyone/firm in blighty isn't allowed to do this, everyone else, knock your socks off.

Another I linked was Alien Breed3D by Team17. They used health packs with red cross on white background, they're based in blighty, yet they didn't get done nor even warned. At least not that I know of.
avatar
blotunga: I'm wondering if the red cross has nothing better to do than chase after game developers, next time they won't get any donations... not from me at least.
avatar
Trilarion: I think you are overreacting there a bit. Not donating because they have a dispute with some small game company about some small symbol used somewhere in some game of them... this is hardly a big thing. And legally it seems to be a protected symbol, so there is even some justification for a dispute. Maybe they just don't want to be related to this particular game.
That sounds more likely, but if they're going to try & ban it from one media or game, that restriction should be across the board, not a pick 'n' mix at their own will.
Post edited January 17, 2017 by fishbaits
avatar
phaolo: Isn't seeing the symbol on medipacks in every game the perfect way to make people remember what it means?
avatar
Kardwill: Thing is, it's NOT really what it means. And that confusion may be what forces them to speak up when they walk across this kind of representation.

That cross does not means "here are medecines". It means "we're the Red Cross, and we're protected by the Geneva Convention. Don't shoot!". And they want that meaning to stick in everyone's mind if they don't want to end up with a rocket up the backside or a bomb on the noggin', like what happened to "Medecins Sans Frontières" last year...
There's something I never thought about. So, they're protected by Geneva Conventions.....And?
What actually happens if someone shoots/bombs someone protected by that act?
I mean, they're in a war zone, there's every chance you're going to be hit, whether by accident or on purpose, but what are they really going to do?

"Oi, you! No, stop that now!"
"Erm, you're in a war zone...?"
"I know, but...erm...."
-Do you want me to bring out the Leroy Nieman paintings?

-No. We cannot risk violating the Geneva Convention!
Reminds me of the time Sensible Software got flak for using images of the poppy, which may have been weirder because it's an existing flower!

If the Red Cross organisation's goal is to sanctify their symbol, set it apart to maintain the seriousness of its status, and prevent it from falling into the hands of pop culture, they're a bit late on the draw aren't they? Decades too late. Doom saw to that, as the article points out.
It has always been my understanding that the Geneva Convention was ratified and signed by multiple countries agreeing to follow certain rules in warfare. I, as a private citizen, am in no way responsible for adhering to any of the rules dictated by the Geneva Convention. Nor am I personally responsible for following UN treaties or non-proliferation agreements signed by my government. So unless these developers actually signed the Geneva Convention personally then it shouldn't really apply to them. At most they are breaking UK copyright law.

Also, the rules of the Geneva Convention are only in effect on battlefields in times of war. I'd say that excludes any and all instances and actions taking place within movies, books or video games. Otherwise half the people playing COD could be brought up on war crimes.
Dumb, that's what that is. About the level of dumb when the WWF sued the other WWF over its name. Yup, because surely people will confuse the World Wrestling Federation for the World Wildlife Fund. Bozos, the lot of them!
avatar
tinyE: There goes Switzerland's plans to invert their flag.
holy crap, that is why the medkits in Xcom have the Swiss flag on them, no copyright on that.
Oddly enough, got a new ship in Elite Dangerous this morning & spotted something inside.
White cross on red background.

Either Braben is leaving blighty to turn into a Swede, or he played it safe too.

https://imgur.com/a/Oqdkp
avatar
Stevedog13: Otherwise half the people playing COD could be brought up on war crimes.
But... but... I was only following orders given at the beginning of the mission :(
Post edited January 21, 2017 by ZFR
Ah, right. The ole' Red Cross stomping of feet. IE, you can't use a bolded red plus sign, so there.

I've observed this many times, and man are they vigilant on this.