Edited my other post to remove them so as to not pollute the thread.

It's been years literally since I played Ultima 4-6, so I probably remember them being more turn based than they were. I'll keep in mind what you said about 7. It's technically something on my backlog, but it's always been described to me as being more of the same in relation to 4-6. I didn't mention Ultima 3 as I know it plays a lot different than 4-6 and is also sitting on my backlog, so I have no clue at all about that one.

I'm very well aware that the series went downhill very fast with 8... like stop at 7 or if you didn't enjoy 7, stop at Underworld 1 & 2 - which technically occur after 6. I stand by my opinions of Underworld, even if they're not exactly turn-based but hey....


Let's get back to Might and Magic - definitely turn based for the earlier games and definitely combat heavy. I played MM2 the most extensively and more times than the rest of the series (as it was my first CRPG, so very fond of it.) While I'm sure that the game has a plot, I always end up being more interested in exploring the entire world and fighting huge stacks of enemies while I'm at it.

It had its quirks and it was very different from 7, but I personally enjoyed Ultima 8 quite a bit. I loved the whole ritual system for the spells, based on different elemental-centric religions.

Of course, this is coming from someone who played Ultima 8 before playing Ultima 7 (but after playing Ultima Underwold 1 & 2). So, I probably had a different set of expectations when I started playing the game.

in other words - "So, what do you considered to be the best gameplay-focused wrpgs?"

I technically played 6 first followed by Savage Empire (which uses the same/similar engine as 6), so invariably end up comparing them all to 6... except for Underworld 1&2 as those are their own thing.

8 was just too radically different when I did encounter it and in ways that didn't feel like an improvement. Although since I have a legal disc copy of 8 (and without DRM too!) that still works, I really should give it another go.... and have enough of a backlog to space these games out a lot and not play them back-to-back. :)

Age of decadence is generally considered the best WRPG ever made. Most importantly, it's recommended by rpgcodex, which is really the only thing that matters.

There are various reasons why I would not trust that site, like their reactions to certain topics (like the creator of Bard's Tale 3), and their enshrining of "brofist" in the forum software.

(Also, problem with that game from my perspective (and with Fallout 1 and 2) is the lack of spells. With that said, said problem does not disqualify said games from this topic.)

It's turn-based though, unless some other commenters (who go on about games like Dragon Age...which is real-time with pause!) I actually took the trouble to read your original comment.
Another game which also might fit your requirements is Underrail (also turn-based, with heavy focus on gameplay/different character builds).
Also doesn't have magic though.

Anyway, as far as good old games with turn-based combat systems are concerned, one could also name Dark Sun: Shattered Lands and Albion.
But of course one of them is based on D&D (which you don't like iirc), and both also feature pretty decent stories and character interactions.
So I suppose the WRPG that could satisfy you doesn't exist.

In my case, the issue with magic is just a personal preference and not something that affects whether it's appropriate to mention a game in this topic.

The "approximately turn-based" thing is there mainly to weed out action games that the term "RPG" is misapplied to, while still allowing a game with a battle system like the one in Final Fantasy 4 through 9.

The RPG (of any sort) that satisfies me in every way doesn't exist.

In fact, even the RPG designs I come up with in my head don't have everything I want in an RPG, mainly because some design decisions are incompatible with one another.

Interactive dialogue is the most important gameplay element in WRPGs besides the character build(s) so I don't really get this topic.