Posted April 20, 2011
Well, what do you know? These are dynamically developing times. So a few more points before I'll really shut up (also to give the others an opportunity to chime in):
1) So we learned Ghost was a lyncher. The obvious question to ask is who was the lynchee? Now I did throw my answer to this question out here quite casually before, but as I reread this day so far, I can see that Robb suggested Damnation (#437), which is downright absurd, if you remember the whole Damnation lynch Robb himself is so keen to keep reminding us of; for explanation why is it so absurd, see Jess (2011:440). Orry, on the other hand, suggested Robb (#438), which is perhaps even more ridiculous, if you remember the whole Ghost lynch. Really, I should think Ghost's target was terribly obvious, and I'm finding it quite difficult to find these two glaring mistakes anything else but deliberate misdirections.
2) This is specifically for Robb, re: post 443
In a way, it does, but then again, if you picked 7 people completely at random from the starting 12, it would still be quite likely there is at least one mafia among them. That doesn't really prove anything at all. And why do you ignore the entirety of D2, the meatiest part of the game, and keep coming back to something that was essentially a random lynch turned wrong?
By the by, this is something I have wanted to bring up for ages, but always forgot; now that I have to deal with time differences a lot, I remembered: we shouldn't forget that a large part of the Damnation lynch happened really, really fast. For myself, I literally slept through the whole thing (the hammer vote was cast at about 3 AM central European time, if I remember correctly) -- which is why I'm not willing to put much stock in who was on that wagon and who wasn't. If I were awake at the time Damnation claimed, I'd be on it, too.
3) Re: Jess' #444 -- yes, one of the reasons I rolled out that "lynching Ghost confirms Robb" theory in the open was to throw a feeler out there and see how Robb was going to react. The swiftness of his face-heel really was beyond expectations.
4) Re: Jess' #453
5) I still don't quite get where did that theory there's a third party around here come from. I went through the list of third party roles and while Damnation pulled off some pretty textbook Jester play, he was not a jester. A survivor I can imagine being here, yes. But other than that? Not really. And at this, LYLO-nearing stage, a good survivor is basically pro-town, anyway, and by its nature, it isn't really a role that would require changing the number of mafia from the standard 25%.
We are in a delicate situation. But I can honestly say that so far in this game, I haven't had a scum read as strong as I do on Robb right now. But I fully admit I need to broaden my perspective a bit now. If someone feels there's a good case to be made against anyone, go ahead, please. We need all the good cases we can open now.
1) So we learned Ghost was a lyncher. The obvious question to ask is who was the lynchee? Now I did throw my answer to this question out here quite casually before, but as I reread this day so far, I can see that Robb suggested Damnation (#437), which is downright absurd, if you remember the whole Damnation lynch Robb himself is so keen to keep reminding us of; for explanation why is it so absurd, see Jess (2011:440). Orry, on the other hand, suggested Robb (#438), which is perhaps even more ridiculous, if you remember the whole Ghost lynch. Really, I should think Ghost's target was terribly obvious, and I'm finding it quite difficult to find these two glaring mistakes anything else but deliberate misdirections.
2) This is specifically for Robb, re: post 443
Robbeasy: Finally - someone with a bit of sense! I've been cleared by Ghost - who was TOWN, remember, and as such can't lie about their role - and before you say it, omission is not lieing.
Again, for someone so adamant to draw D1 into this, it is very odd how you flat out ignore what happened that day. Town can't lie about their role? So what was it Damnation did, exactly? In a way, it does, but then again, if you picked 7 people completely at random from the starting 12, it would still be quite likely there is at least one mafia among them. That doesn't really prove anything at all. And why do you ignore the entirety of D2, the meatiest part of the game, and keep coming back to something that was essentially a random lynch turned wrong?
By the by, this is something I have wanted to bring up for ages, but always forgot; now that I have to deal with time differences a lot, I remembered: we shouldn't forget that a large part of the Damnation lynch happened really, really fast. For myself, I literally slept through the whole thing (the hammer vote was cast at about 3 AM central European time, if I remember correctly) -- which is why I'm not willing to put much stock in who was on that wagon and who wasn't. If I were awake at the time Damnation claimed, I'd be on it, too.
3) Re: Jess' #444 -- yes, one of the reasons I rolled out that "lynching Ghost confirms Robb" theory in the open was to throw a feeler out there and see how Robb was going to react. The swiftness of his face-heel really was beyond expectations.
4) Re: Jess' #453
jesskitten: What do you mean by his vanilla mason claim is interesting? Or what do you think of that, rather?
I think it has already been said here: it just doesn't feel right, does it? By now, it's pretty clear this setup is fairly complex. Uses some of the less common power roles (like jailer), possibly in unusual variations (like ability cop). And a mason/lyncher paired with a vanilla mason feels very out of place here. A mason/lynchee would indeed go well with it, but that is obviously not the case. I'd take a mason/tracker, for example, or a mason/vig, but vanilla mason seems far too... vanilla for this game. Not to mention "Jack White", which really feels like a lazy fakeclaim. 5) I still don't quite get where did that theory there's a third party around here come from. I went through the list of third party roles and while Damnation pulled off some pretty textbook Jester play, he was not a jester. A survivor I can imagine being here, yes. But other than that? Not really. And at this, LYLO-nearing stage, a good survivor is basically pro-town, anyway, and by its nature, it isn't really a role that would require changing the number of mafia from the standard 25%.
We are in a delicate situation. But I can honestly say that so far in this game, I haven't had a scum read as strong as I do on Robb right now. But I fully admit I need to broaden my perspective a bit now. If someone feels there's a good case to be made against anyone, go ahead, please. We need all the good cases we can open now.