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General discussionDRM is bad, but this takes it to the next level. Flight sim company adds Malware as "DRM"(186 posts)(186 posts)
(186 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted February 23, 2018
I'm waiting for the end credits of this thread .
Posted February 23, 2018
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RWarehall: Frankly it seems more people are worried about this developer than they are worried about pirated software containing malware put there by pirates.
We are not worrying about the devs at all we are just worried how the devs might have broken extremely important laws.

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RWarehall: Furthermore, most laws have multiple facets. For example, murder means use of deadly force plus intent to use this deadly force. I'm sure most malware statues are similar conditions. One of which likely is gathering personal information for personal gain. In this case, that does not appear to be what the developer is doing. The case would fail on that clause alone.
You would not call it "murder" anymore but manslaughter and the sentence would be lower - still it would be illegal and punished. Same would apply here if they were convicted.

You told people here multiple times that we are no lawyers and I agreed to this before. Still it is a bit strange that you seem to know the laws better than anybody of us (talking about how most courts would react). Makes me wonder if you have such experiences for real or if we are just talking about assumptions against assumptions?
Post edited February 23, 2018 by MarkoH01
Posted February 23, 2018
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RWarehall: If I buy drugs from a dealer and he shorts me, I cannot sue them.
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MarkoH01: Don't know if it's different in America but here in Germany -unbelievable but true- exactly this happened. The drug buyer wanted to file charges against the dealer. He was able to do so but they also filed charges against him.

(Of course it's only German but Google translate might help)
https://twitter.com/Polizei_Rostock/status/958259370550349825?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FPolizei_Rostock%2Fstatus%2F958259370550349825
I don't know about that but on "World's Dumbest Criminals" they had a story about a guy that called the police on his drug dealer because he sold him baking soda instead of actual cocaine.

They also had a guy who called the police about a drug dealer working on the street corner of his apartment block. This was true, but what was also true is that the caller was himself a drug dealer, and was calling the police to get the other dealer busted so that he could then deal on that corner.
Post edited February 23, 2018 by tinyE
Posted February 23, 2018
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tinyE: I don't know about that but on "World's Dumbest Criminals" they had a story about a guy that called the police on his drug dealer because he sold him baking soda instead of actual cocaine.
So did they file charges or not?
Posted February 23, 2018
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tinyE: I don't know about that but on "World's Dumbest Criminals" they had a story about a guy that called the police on his drug dealer because he sold him baking soda instead of actual cocaine.
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MarkoH01: So did they file charges or not?
I don't know. :P I'm not trying to make a point, I'm just trying to lighten the mood in here. :P
Posted February 23, 2018
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MarkoH01: So did they file charges or not?
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tinyE: I don't know. :P I'm not trying to make a point, I'm just trying to lighten the mood in here. :P
Why not do both? :D
Posted February 23, 2018
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tinyE: I don't know. :P I'm not trying to make a point, I'm just trying to lighten the mood in here. :P
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MarkoH01: Why not do both? :D
If I recall, the guy who called the cops for being sold fake drugs got busted for abusing the 911 line; you can't arrest someone for buying, or selling, a bag of baking powder, even if they thought it was real drugs. :P The other guy got busted for dealeing after he was caught dealing on that corner the next day.
Posted February 23, 2018
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MarkoH01: Why not do both? :D
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tinyE: If I recall, the guy who called the cops for being sold fake drugs got busted for abusing the 911 line; you can't arrest someone for buying, or selling, a bag of baking powder, even if they thought it was real drugs. :P The other guy got busted for dealeing after he was caught dealing on that corner the next day.
Interesting. This seems to be different in Germany. According to the Twitter link I posted (directly from German police) even TRYING to buy forbidden substances is punishable and trying to file charges the buyer must have told the Police that he WANTED to buy drugs.
Post edited February 23, 2018 by MarkoH01
Posted February 23, 2018
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tinyE: If I recall, the guy who called the cops for being sold fake drugs got busted for abusing the 911 line; you can't arrest someone for buying, or selling, a bag of baking powder, even if they thought it was real drugs. :P The other guy got busted for dealeing after he was caught dealing on that corner the next day.
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MarkoH01: Interesting. This seems to be different in Germany. According to the Twitter link I posted (directly from German police) even TRYING to buy forbidden substances is punishable and trying to file charges the buyer must have told the Police that he WANTED to buy drugs.
somehow that sounds right here too, but they might have just gone easy on him for being such an idiot. :P That does happen over here. If someone is deemed "not worth the time" they may not throw the book at him.
Posted February 23, 2018
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MarkoH01: Interesting. This seems to be different in Germany. According to the Twitter link I posted (directly from German police) even TRYING to buy forbidden substances is punishable and trying to file charges the buyer must have told the Police that he WANTED to buy drugs.
It's true here too. There are stories of people being busted for buying oregano from the cops because they thought it was marijuana.
Posted February 23, 2018
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MarkoH01: Interesting. This seems to be different in Germany. According to the Twitter link I posted (directly from German police) even TRYING to buy forbidden substances is punishable and trying to file charges the buyer must have told the Police that he WANTED to buy drugs.
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paladin181: It's true here too. There are stories of people being busted for buying oregano from the cops because they thought it was marijuana.
I guess it depends on the cop and where then. Where I grew up I could see someone getting busted for buying oregano, but there is no way it happens where I live now.
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i_hope_you_rot: I'm waiting for the end credits of this thread .
https://youtu.be/iH6a1iYQ0GA?t=103
Post edited February 23, 2018 by tinyE
Posted February 23, 2018
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tinyE: https://youtu.be/iH6a1iYQ0GA?t=103
Yay! This is the REAL Star Wars :)
Posted February 23, 2018
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RWarehall: Here's the problem and it's the way almost every court works...

If I buy drugs from a dealer and he shorts me, I cannot sue them. If I go to court, the court will just dismiss the case because they will not let themselves be clogged up with cases involving criminals vs criminals. For someone to sue them, as it stands, that person would have to go to court, talk about illegally downloading that DLC from a pirate site to claim they got malware. Court throws it right out.
You are still holding on the idea that this is a civil matter, when what the developers have admitted of doing could easily get the FBI involved if anyone bothers to inform them about it. The developers did without a permit what even the law enforcers are not supposed to do without a warrant, so surely that also has to break some form of a law that the justice system is unlikely to just let go unpunished?
Posted February 23, 2018
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RWarehall: If I buy drugs from a dealer and he shorts me, I cannot sue them.
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MarkoH01: Don't know if it's different in America but here in Germany -unbelievable but true- exactly this happened. The drug buyer wanted to file charges against the dealer. He was able to do so but they also filed charges against him.
Here in the US, we call the police about buying bad drugs.

Not the recent one I was thinking of but:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/drug-dealer-arrested-cocaine-stolen-burglary-report-police-florida-man-david-blackmon-a7850806.html

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RWarehall: First off, courts don't see it that way. They see it as theft of property and assign fines as such.

As to crackers, you have that wrong, depending on the game they may have to send something back to the server. These dummy codes (often generated) are sent back in the background. In fact, a lot of GoG software does the same thing with generic serial numbers embedded for activation purposes.
I could sit here and provide examples of where courts don;t consider it theft of property but I only have a few minutes and the other point I feel is more important.

I came up via the hacking community. I read and wrote tutorials on Fravia way back then. (And if you don;t know what that is, don't ask. And no you can't have my name on there.)

No legit release group would release a release that relied on using a specific serial number or set of numbers. Doing that would entail a call back to the developers/ publishers and that is one of those "it simply isn't done."
Post edited February 23, 2018 by drmike
Posted February 23, 2018
Wow, I can't believe these guys have taken their "DRM technology" to unimaginable levels. I mean, nasty DRMs are bad, but this is just plain ridiculous... (⚆_⚆)
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionDRM is bad, but this takes it to the next level. Flight sim company adds Malware as "DRM"(186 posts)(186 posts)
(186 posts)