It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
TotalBiscuit just uploaded his own analysis on the matter. I must say, he did an absolutely fantastic job of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yX4io2O4EI
avatar
Wishbone: Do you also dislike the idea that a musician could make money by playing on a guitar he didn't build himself?

No, it's not a perfect analogy, but my point is that they are not making money off the games but off the videos, which they do make themselves.
avatar
SirPrimalform: Ok... to fix this analogy we're going to have to change some things. The game is not the instrument, the computer/console is the instrument. The game is the song.

Now, if someone was making loads of money covering other people's songs and not giving any money to the people who wrote the songs, don't you think that's a bit unfair?
Yes, but that's a much worse analogy. These people aren't taking games and releasing them as their own. If that's what they were doing, your analogy would fit. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same as playing it yourself, it just isn't.

Also, do you really think that Let's Plays are lowering the number of game sales? I'm pretty sure it's raising it. It's free advertising for the games, unless of course the game sucks, but in that case chances are that not many people want to either make or watch Let's Plays of it.
avatar
SirPrimalform: Ok... to fix this analogy we're going to have to change some things. The game is not the instrument, the computer/console is the instrument. The game is the song.

Now, if someone was making loads of money covering other people's songs and not giving any money to the people who wrote the songs, don't you think that's a bit unfair?
avatar
Wishbone: Yes, but that's a much worse analogy. These people aren't taking games and releasing them as their own. If that's what they were doing, your analogy would fit. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same as playing it yourself, it just isn't.

Also, do you really think that Let's Plays are lowering the number of game sales? I'm pretty sure it's raising it. It's free advertising for the games, unless of course the game sucks, but in that case chances are that not many people want to either make or watch Let's Plays of it.
They are using someone else's material though. The LPer for the most part only takes the material and adds very little to it. Most LPs are just raw footage with terrible commentary added, and if the owners of the intellectual property want to complain OR prevent the LPer from profiting form it that's their prerogative. There are exceptions, though, where the footage acquired from the games is barely just half of what makes that particular LP special (Docfuture's Sonic 2 Special which has a shitload of editing and altering of things, it is a really interesting watch, Research Indicates's Jurassic Park Trespasser which is professionally edited and cut very well, Geop's Assassin's Creed 1 and 2 LPs which are half Ass Creed footage, half REALLY good history lesson). Strangely though, as far as I know they have not monetized those videos.

I for one have caused a couple of extra sales of some Atlus games with my captures, but that had to do more with showing off the base mechanics AND a basic guide than me being a good read or a good narrator, LPing does work as a showcase, but it should be more about the game and WAY LESS about the goddamn LPer.
avatar
Luisfius: They are using someone else's material though. The LPer for the most part only takes the material and adds very little to it. Most LPs are just raw footage with terrible commentary added, and if the owners of the intellectual property want to complain OR prevent the LPer from profiting form it that's their prerogative.
Certainly. They are legally entitled to do it, I'm just questioning whether it is wise to do so.
avatar
Luisfius: I for one have caused a couple of extra sales of some Atlus games with my captures, but that had to do more with showing off the base mechanics AND a basic guide than me being a good read or a good narrator, LPing does work as a showcase, but it should be more about the game and WAY LESS about the goddamn LPer.
Well, I'd say it depends a lot on both the game and the LPer. I'm a big fan of several members of the Yogscast, and I enjoy their videos more for them as LPers than for the games they play.
avatar
Luisfius: They are using someone else's material though. The LPer for the most part only takes the material and adds very little to it. Most LPs are just raw footage with terrible commentary added, and if the owners of the intellectual property want to complain OR prevent the LPer from profiting form it that's their prerogative.
avatar
Wishbone: Certainly. They are legally entitled to do it, I'm just questioning whether it is wise to do so.
avatar
Luisfius: I for one have caused a couple of extra sales of some Atlus games with my captures, but that had to do more with showing off the base mechanics AND a basic guide than me being a good read or a good narrator, LPing does work as a showcase, but it should be more about the game and WAY LESS about the goddamn LPer.
avatar
Wishbone: Well, I'd say it depends a lot on both the game and the LPer. I'm a big fan of several members of the Yogscast, and I enjoy their videos more for them as LPers than for the games they play.
True. Yogscast does interesting stuff. But then again that also comes from them doing interesting shit with a wide open sandbox.
Personally I don't care at all for Minecraft LPS but I've enjoyed a couple of the yogscast vids.
avatar
Wishbone: Yes, but that's a much worse analogy. These people aren't taking games and releasing them as their own. If that's what they were doing, your analogy would fit. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same as playing it yourself, it just isn't.

Also, do you really think that Let's Plays are lowering the number of game sales? I'm pretty sure it's raising it. It's free advertising for the games, unless of course the game sucks, but in that case chances are that not many people want to either make or watch Let's Plays of it.
I said they were covering the songs, not claiming they were their own. I didn't suggest Let's Plays were lowering the number of game sales, I was just trying to fix your analogy.
avatar
Wishbone: Yes, but that's a much worse analogy. These people aren't taking games and releasing them as their own. If that's what they were doing, your analogy would fit. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same as playing it yourself, it just isn't.

Also, do you really think that Let's Plays are lowering the number of game sales? I'm pretty sure it's raising it. It's free advertising for the games, unless of course the game sucks, but in that case chances are that not many people want to either make or watch Let's Plays of it.
avatar
SirPrimalform: I said they were covering the songs, not claiming they were their own. I didn't suggest Let's Plays were lowering the number of game sales, I was just trying to fix your analogy.
Yes, but covering a song means putting the same material out in the same medium as the original, giving a similar experience. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same experience as playing the game yourself, not by a long shot.
avatar
Wishbone: Yes, but covering a song means putting the same material out in the same medium as the original, giving a similar experience. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same experience as playing the game yourself, not by a long shot.
I get that, again I was just trying to improve your analogy. The flaws you're noting were present in your analogy.
Post edited May 17, 2013 by SirPrimalform
avatar
Wishbone: Yes, but covering a song means putting the same material out in the same medium as the original, giving a similar experience. Watching a video of someone playing a game is not the same experience as playing the game yourself, not by a long shot.
avatar
SirPrimalform: I get that, again I was just trying to improve your analogy. The flaws you're noting were present in your analogy.
No they were not. Your analogy was about delivering the same material in the same medium, leading to a similar experience. My analogy was about using the same material in a different medium, leading to a different experience. A guitar is not the same thing as a piece of music. A game is not the same thing as a video. A song however, is the same thing as a song.
avatar
SirPrimalform: I get that, again I was just trying to improve your analogy. The flaws you're noting were present in your analogy.
avatar
Wishbone: No they were not. Your analogy was about delivering the same material in the same medium, leading to a similar experience. My analogy was about using the same material in a different medium, leading to a different experience. A guitar is not the same thing as a piece of music. A game is not the same thing as a video. A song however, is the same thing as a song.
You're right, I was misunderstanding the purpose of your analogy. However, a guitar is a machine. It's simply not comparable to a game or a song.

Another flaw in your analogy is that the same song could be played on any number of different guitars. A Let's Play is very specific to the game it is about. It wouldn't be anything like the same thing with a different game.

I'm sorry, but it's just a terrible analogy.
Post edited May 17, 2013 by SirPrimalform
avatar
Darvond: To summarize, I do feel this won't end well for Nintendo.
So even as they pull their heads out of their ass to quit fucking small/indie/3rd party devs they keep pulling their other same old shenanigans. Yeah I don't expect Nintendo to change over night, they are a big ship, after all. But when a lot of your main IPs are coming up stale, your major living room console is coming up DOA (seriously, they'd have to pull a Pokemon MMO out of their asses to save the Wii U by now) you'd think they maybe could think twice before pissing off gamers.

Even EA feels free to give them the big "fuck you and shove your Wii U up your ass!"

So now they're left with old IPs that most of their teams are failing to leverage into anything that isn't unpleasantly tired... umm "oops".


But hey, we'll be able to play our iOS games on Wii U soon, I'm sure that will balance it all out!
Post edited May 17, 2013 by orcishgamer
Personally, I spend a fair amount of time watching LP's on YouTube.
I've bought several games because I watched someone play them and upload it to YouTube.

Going after LP'ers ad revenue is silly imho, since it'll lead to LESS exposure since the LP'ers will just move on to games they can monetize.

Two other blog posts about this matter I'd like to link here are the following:

Mike Bithell (creator of Thomas Was Alone) on how Let's plays helped boost his sales

Dinnerbone (Minecraft developer) with his opinion on the value of LP's for game developers
avatar
Novotnus: I watch Let's Plays in two situations:
- When I wonder if I want to buy the game and want to see it in action,
- When I really like the game and want to see somebody else playing it with a commentary.
First case - if the game's good, I'll probably end up buying it so - no loss on the dev side.
Second case - I already own the game. No loss on the dev side.
Your personal experience doesn't change the fact that some people might watch the Let's Play video instead of buying the game, especially the ones that are heavily story driven such as Heavy Rain and MGS4.
avatar
Novotnus: I can't understand this kind of people - the whole point of gaming is that games are interactive :) When I watch a Let's Play of a good game, I want to play it myself, make different choices and do things my way.
It really depends on the game. Watching a Let's Play of Fahrenheit or Heavy Rain would probably spoil the whole game since these are not as interactive as other games. Adventure games in general are so scripted that watching a Let's Play video spoils the experience completely.
Post edited May 17, 2013 by Neobr10
avatar
Hesusio: TotalBiscuit just uploaded his own analysis on the matter. I must say, he did an absolutely fantastic job of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yX4io2O4EI
Wow, he nailed that, thanks for posting!
avatar
Wishbone: Do you also dislike the idea that a musician could make money by playing on a guitar he didn't build himself?

No, it's not a perfect analogy, but my point is that they are not making money off the games but off the videos, which they do make themselves.
Terrible analogy.
avatar
Darvond: So you miss out on games you couldn't otherwise own or obtain legally? Or games so bafflingly obscure, you didn't know they existed until some source brought them to attention?
As far as i'm aware Nintendo's move affects Let's Play videos only, not reviews or videos showing gameplay sections. You really don't have to watch an entire Let's Play to get to know an "obscure" game.
avatar
Darvond: What I meant was missing out on titles I would have never heard of had it not been for Let's Play, such as Terranigma being namedropped in a video, or versions of games I never have guessed to exist such as a Turbografix version of Hatris.
But that's the point: you can find out about a game just by watcing small sections of it, you don't need to watch the whole game, which is what LPers do.
Post edited May 17, 2013 by Neobr10