Posted September 24, 2011
wormholewizards
TNAimpact
Registered: Mar 2011
From Malaysia
Kleetus
For Internal Use Only
Registered: Sep 2010
From Australia
Posted September 24, 2011
No, Call of Juarez: The Cartel was more disappointing and boring.
You guys are taking Dead Island too seriously.
Ignore the crappy story and atrocious voice-acting.
The inventory management sucks, and the game lacks polish, but it's fun.
Yes it's repetitive, but I still enjoy making weapons and killing zombies, especially if you play with a few mates.
You guys are taking Dead Island too seriously.
Ignore the crappy story and atrocious voice-acting.
The inventory management sucks, and the game lacks polish, but it's fun.
Yes it's repetitive, but I still enjoy making weapons and killing zombies, especially if you play with a few mates.
Aaden
New User
Registered: May 2011
From Germany
Posted September 25, 2011
You guys are taking Dead Island too seriously.
Ignore the crappy story and atrocious voice-acting.
The inventory management sucks, and the game lacks polish, but it's fun.
Yes it's repetitive, but I still enjoy making weapons and killing zombies, especially if you play with a few mates.
But agreed, The Cartel is a real shame. I really enjoyed the Call of Juarez series. There's a serious lack of good western games. And what do they do? Turn it into a shallow modern times druglord police shooter thingy. :(
VoodooEconomist
Bhikshu
Registered: May 2009
From Poland
Kleetus
For Internal Use Only
Registered: Sep 2010
From Australia
VoodooEconomist
Bhikshu
Registered: May 2009
From Poland
Posted September 26, 2011
I've heard Red Dead Redemption is quite nice. However it never hit the PC, so I'll never no.
Kleetus
For Internal Use Only
Registered: Sep 2010
From Australia
Posted September 26, 2011
Yeah, I'd SO love to play that.
After the terrible GTA IV PC release, I can't see RockStar being too eager on Red Dead ever coming to PC, unfortunately.
The only western PC games I've played and own are Call of Juarez, Call of Juarez: Bound in Blood, Gun, Outlaws and Dead Man's Hand.
That's a tiny fraction of all the shooters/RPG's ever made.
After the terrible GTA IV PC release, I can't see RockStar being too eager on Red Dead ever coming to PC, unfortunately.
The only western PC games I've played and own are Call of Juarez, Call of Juarez: Bound in Blood, Gun, Outlaws and Dead Man's Hand.
That's a tiny fraction of all the shooters/RPG's ever made.
VoodooEconomist
Bhikshu
Registered: May 2009
From Poland
Posted September 26, 2011
Neversoft's "GUN" was also kinda nice - had all the campy trappings of a revisionist western, and one of the NPCs was voiced by Ron Pearlman, which is always a plus.
But I agree, there is not enough westerns. Also the Age of Sail is underrperesented. The naval battles in the Total War and the East Indian Company series are only a fraction of the awesomeness that they could've been...
But I agree, there is not enough westerns. Also the Age of Sail is underrperesented. The naval battles in the Total War and the East Indian Company series are only a fraction of the awesomeness that they could've been...
LionofPerth
New User
Registered: Jul 2011
From Australia
Posted September 26, 2011
And to add to it, good, proper western cyberpunk. Nothing even distantly related to anime or other Japanese models.
As good as sail based naval warfare would be, just too quick and messy. You also need to have the weather as a factor, which might be too much for some. Still would awesome, but properly niche, unlike another game.
As good as sail based naval warfare would be, just too quick and messy. You also need to have the weather as a factor, which might be too much for some. Still would awesome, but properly niche, unlike another game.
VoodooEconomist
Bhikshu
Registered: May 2009
From Poland
Posted September 26, 2011
To me that's precisely where it's beauty lies - you can have any level of detail, from very simplistic ideas like in Port Royale or Pirates! to giving the player the options of precisely determining the sizes and locations of canons, stowing of cargo and detailed rigging! The ability to fly different colours, camouflage a vessel as a trading ship, escape after sunset, lead invasions and maintain blockades, or even the options to chase galleons full with colonial silver of merchantmen loaded with exotic spices would be nice as well.
And it wouldn't have to be messy, since naval combat at that tme was quite time-consuming, if the slowest setting was "real-time" few people would choose it.
Agreed with the cyberpunk-western thing. There were some attepmts to replicate gibsonian-cyberpunk by mixing cyber with noir though.
And it wouldn't have to be messy, since naval combat at that tme was quite time-consuming, if the slowest setting was "real-time" few people would choose it.
Agreed with the cyberpunk-western thing. There were some attepmts to replicate gibsonian-cyberpunk by mixing cyber with noir though.
LionofPerth
New User
Registered: Jul 2011
From Australia
Posted September 26, 2011
Knowing that the Brit's liked a good three shots a minute from... 12 to 18, even 24, pound guns, which were rated as their second line vessels and frigates, real time is quite fast for combat with muzzle loaders.
Fair point on the mentioned titles, could be a lot of fun, stone cannon balls were used on vessels for some time. The curse of having an academic source or two and going to uni. Still it has to be said that the time consuming part is just finding the other guys, naval warfare remains fundamentally very destructive to both crew and vessel. Months to years to replace a good sized vessel, without the trained crew to handle it, which is in itself a long process.
Think the largest cannon, actual cannon, rather than deck gun comes in at 42 pounds. That might only be the English, the French used some pretty heavy shot.
Sorry for the geek out, just happens to be of those areas I have a soft spot for.
As for the cyberpunk, truth be told I would like to see a new Shadowrun CRPG, not MP shooter, not something with the Shadowrun title. Ideally more on the Witcher RPG side of it, maybe first Mass Effect, but at the end of the day strong western, corporate warfare with deniable assests in a dystopian world. Even better if it would take some aesthetic cues from Blade Runner, a few from Dark Angel as well. Both have got strong looks, and very western looks at that.
I even wrote a pen and paper game around that. Shame I can't play in it.
Fair point on the mentioned titles, could be a lot of fun, stone cannon balls were used on vessels for some time. The curse of having an academic source or two and going to uni. Still it has to be said that the time consuming part is just finding the other guys, naval warfare remains fundamentally very destructive to both crew and vessel. Months to years to replace a good sized vessel, without the trained crew to handle it, which is in itself a long process.
Think the largest cannon, actual cannon, rather than deck gun comes in at 42 pounds. That might only be the English, the French used some pretty heavy shot.
Sorry for the geek out, just happens to be of those areas I have a soft spot for.
As for the cyberpunk, truth be told I would like to see a new Shadowrun CRPG, not MP shooter, not something with the Shadowrun title. Ideally more on the Witcher RPG side of it, maybe first Mass Effect, but at the end of the day strong western, corporate warfare with deniable assests in a dystopian world. Even better if it would take some aesthetic cues from Blade Runner, a few from Dark Angel as well. Both have got strong looks, and very western looks at that.
I even wrote a pen and paper game around that. Shame I can't play in it.
Post edited September 26, 2011 by LionofPerth
VoodooEconomist
Bhikshu
Registered: May 2009
From Poland
Posted September 26, 2011
Three a minute? I was under the impression that in the early XIXth century three broadsides in 5 minutes was the hallmark of a well-trained crew, and four as excellent. Of course my sources are works of literary fiction by C. S. Forester and Patrick O'Brian, yet both have the reputation of being very thoroughly researched.
Stil 3 shots a minute are not so tough. I'm a pretty awful and nooby SC2 player and I manage a steady 60 actions per minute, with more in crisis-mode, so it's technically feasible to create such a game. And of course the lookout part of the game where finding the enemies position might seem like a hurdle for the more casual gamer, people still play and make modern naval warfare simulators and submarine combat simulators. Naval warfare geeks, to be sure, but if the cold technical search by radar, sonar, plane and helicopter is replaced with an exciting rendition of spotting sails, the anxiety of what colours she flies, and what action to plan (maybe as a pre-engagement mini-game?) coud overcome that?
The thing is the industry is convinced this must stay a nieche genre just because all detailed simulators are overcomplex and for the geeky, and everything lighter must be spiced with other elements or it will not sell. And while I enjoy the economic encigne of Port Royale and the EIC and the repetetive yet engaging plot elements of Pirates! I don't understand whil noone (except meybe for "Sea Legends") ever concentrated on naval combat as the main point of a game not an addition, gimmick or mini-game. My hopes lie with the indie scene at the moment.
And sir, you've won my heart as a fellow pn'p-RPG player. Sadly, for me very few cRPGs come close to the warm feeling that hobby evokes, maybe Planescape:Torment and the Witcher series, and some rougelikes for dungeoncrawling.
Stil 3 shots a minute are not so tough. I'm a pretty awful and nooby SC2 player and I manage a steady 60 actions per minute, with more in crisis-mode, so it's technically feasible to create such a game. And of course the lookout part of the game where finding the enemies position might seem like a hurdle for the more casual gamer, people still play and make modern naval warfare simulators and submarine combat simulators. Naval warfare geeks, to be sure, but if the cold technical search by radar, sonar, plane and helicopter is replaced with an exciting rendition of spotting sails, the anxiety of what colours she flies, and what action to plan (maybe as a pre-engagement mini-game?) coud overcome that?
The thing is the industry is convinced this must stay a nieche genre just because all detailed simulators are overcomplex and for the geeky, and everything lighter must be spiced with other elements or it will not sell. And while I enjoy the economic encigne of Port Royale and the EIC and the repetetive yet engaging plot elements of Pirates! I don't understand whil noone (except meybe for "Sea Legends") ever concentrated on naval combat as the main point of a game not an addition, gimmick or mini-game. My hopes lie with the indie scene at the moment.
And sir, you've won my heart as a fellow pn'p-RPG player. Sadly, for me very few cRPGs come close to the warm feeling that hobby evokes, maybe Planescape:Torment and the Witcher series, and some rougelikes for dungeoncrawling.
Aaden
New User
Registered: May 2011
From Germany
Posted September 26, 2011
Stil 3 shots a minute are not so tough. I'm a pretty awful and nooby SC2 player and I manage a steady 60 actions per minute, with more in crisis-mode, so it's technically feasible to create such a game. And of course the lookout part of the game where finding the enemies position might seem like a hurdle for the more casual gamer, people still play and make modern naval warfare simulators and submarine combat simulators. Naval warfare geeks, to be sure, but if the cold technical search by radar, sonar, plane and helicopter is replaced with an exciting rendition of spotting sails, the anxiety of what colours she flies, and what action to plan (maybe as a pre-engagement mini-game?) coud overcome that?
The thing is the industry is convinced this must stay a nieche genre just because all detailed simulators are overcomplex and for the geeky, and everything lighter must be spiced with other elements or it will not sell. And while I enjoy the economic encigne of Port Royale and the EIC and the repetetive yet engaging plot elements of Pirates! I don't understand whil noone (except meybe for "Sea Legends") ever concentrated on naval combat as the main point of a game not an addition, gimmick or mini-game. My hopes lie with the indie scene at the moment.
And sir, you've won my heart as a fellow pn'p-RPG player. Sadly, for me very few cRPGs come close to the warm feeling that hobby evokes, maybe Planescape:Torment and the Witcher series, and some rougelikes for dungeoncrawling.
You know, talking about that topic, makes me remember that back in 2006 (?) when Oblivion came out and I had played it for a while, I've been dreaming of a total conversion set in a Fantasy-touched alternate 18th/19th century world. I figured the guild rank system would do great with your rank in the Royal Navy (or whatever faction, you chose), working your way up from a low seaman all the way to captain or admiral even. Or you'd choose a more administrative path to become Governor of a city later on. To name only two of the paths I had imagined. I wanted pirates in it, and treasures, and curses and all kinds of sea monsters (taken from contemporary tales) and sea battles of course. I dreamed of romantic colonial cities, small outposts with wooden palisades, expeditions into thick jungles, native tribes, uncounted mysteries in the unknown of an largely unexplored world, all kinds of real and mystic opportunities and dangers lurking in the wilderness. Alas! it never happened.
I hope, by the way, that Risen 2 will offer some small part of that. Looks promising and I loved everything Piranha Bytes created so far (apart from Gothic 3, which was quite a disappointment).
Post edited September 26, 2011 by Aaden
LionofPerth
New User
Registered: Jul 2011
From Australia
Posted September 27, 2011
@ Voodoo. That's what my material suggests, as for the quality of that work, it could be better. Some of the sources they used weren't really that good, in comparison to Admiralty material from the time.
Modern simulators are time to target and lock on more than anything else. Detection is pretty easy and you don't really have to work for it. Sail you can miss them by mere miles, and then spend more time to find them. Would I appreciate that? Yes I would, the question is more about others.
Oddly enough a turn based game could work wonders, get rid of the search/locate as game play and focus it on the actual combat. Animate rigging falling/being repaired etc, have an area where you can track a ship, but not know its colours, all of the core elements, without the overt need for realism. I'd think about playing that.
Planescape was brilliant, no two words about it.
@ Aaden
That could be interesting, although I would ask how you plan on having officers from the ranks. For example in the Royal Navy it was possible to buy a commission as a Midshipman, but no further up the chain. So would you have at some point a mechanism that a senior enough sailor spends some money to progress?
Still sounds like a very good idea, always wanted a merchant trader empire I ran.
Modern simulators are time to target and lock on more than anything else. Detection is pretty easy and you don't really have to work for it. Sail you can miss them by mere miles, and then spend more time to find them. Would I appreciate that? Yes I would, the question is more about others.
Oddly enough a turn based game could work wonders, get rid of the search/locate as game play and focus it on the actual combat. Animate rigging falling/being repaired etc, have an area where you can track a ship, but not know its colours, all of the core elements, without the overt need for realism. I'd think about playing that.
Planescape was brilliant, no two words about it.
@ Aaden
That could be interesting, although I would ask how you plan on having officers from the ranks. For example in the Royal Navy it was possible to buy a commission as a Midshipman, but no further up the chain. So would you have at some point a mechanism that a senior enough sailor spends some money to progress?
Still sounds like a very good idea, always wanted a merchant trader empire I ran.
Post edited September 27, 2011 by LionofPerth
Kleetus
For Internal Use Only
Registered: Sep 2010
From Australia
Posted October 02, 2011
I wonder where the OP is, I miss him? :)